31 replies to this topic

[smokingwreckage]

Pretty sure the MSPs were formulated to have enough flow improver in them for most uses. I remember it was a hot issue at the time; VMC were pretty popular with top shelf painters, but they flow horribly.

Personally when I have time to paint, messing about with flow improvers, mediums, including a matte medium I have that is the consistency of wood glue and makes paint tackier rather than flow-i-er, is a lot of the fun.

Play with the paint. It's mischievous stuff.

[CashWiley]

My current mix is basically Les Bursley's wash mix without the inks. It's a 1:1 of matte medium : distilled water/flow improver (10:1). Seems to work pretty nicely in the little bit I've played with it, but I'm still in the first steps of finding my way with thinned paints. Back in the day we just painted off the paint pot's cap. Now I'm using the mix in no particular ratio, just when the paint feels like it's flowing really nicely.

Not sure I understand why thinning paint with just water is better for layering than using a matte medium?

[zoroaster100]

I'm new to painting and have only painted about 10 minis so far. But so far I'm finding the Reaper MSP's seem to do just fine with me out of the bottle or mixed with water for washes. However, after reading that The Craft article, Let it Flow, on Reaper's site I decided to try using thinner and drying retarder and water as a thinning solution and am finding it useful for even better flow for very fine details.

[ferret]

I use matte media when I want to reduce the pigment density of a paint without making as fluid (watery) as thinning with water. For the most part, that means glazes but I also add a smaller amount of matte media to ink washes because it makes it easier for me to control than a really thin wash.

I do not normally use flow improver with MSP since they flow very well without it. However, I definitely like it for getting paint or a wash down into areas where there are a lot of small depressions that water surface tension makes it hard to get paint into, for example, fur with relatively high texture.

90+ percent of the time I find distilled water works great to thin MSP and there is no need to give any thought to formulas.

[ced1106]

Fellow n00b, but from reading the internets:

Matte: Paint without pigmentation. By adding matte, the viscosity isn't reduced, but the pigmentation is. Matte sticks to the same places paint does without the result being "pancake makeup".

Flow: Water for miniatures. By adding flow aid and water, the paint viscosity becomes more watery, and the pigmentation is reduced. Flow aid and water puts the pigmentation in the crevasses.

Both are cheap at Michael's with a 40% off one item coupon! If anything, learn to control the paint at various mixture ratios, so you don't have to learn it when you do use it. Don't forget your eye droppers!

[cthulhudarren]

Fellow n00b, but from reading the internets: Matte: Paint without pigmentation. By adding matte, the viscosity isn't reduced, but the pigmentation is. Matte sticks to the same places paint does without the result being "pancake makeup". Flow: Water for miniatures. By adding flow aid and water, the paint viscosity becomes more watery, and the pigmentation is reduced. Flow aid and water puts the pigmentation in the crevasses. Both are cheap at Michael's with a 40% off one item coupon! If anything, learn to control the paint at various mixture ratios, so you don't have to learn it when you do use it. Don't forget your eye droppers!

Speaking of Michaels, I was looking on their online site to see what to buy there. I didn't see any flow aid. I found matte though. The brushes on the website were all synthetic Martha Stewart, and didn't find the kneadatite. Is that kind of stuff not online or not in the store at all. I literally am starting with nothing but two of the reaper starter sets from the kickstarter.

[Argentee]

The Michael's website is only tangentially related to store inventory. They should have other brushes and flow improver. You may have to ask for help finding the flow improver.

[ced1106]

Worth a read: http://darkfuturegam...-additives.html (:

EDIT: Looks like we can fiddle with matte and flow aid to prevent thinned paint from beading directly on Bones plastic...

[smokingwreckage]

Oh, and Reaper sells, or used to, matting agent. It's NOT MATTE MEDIUM. It's like, concentrated matt-ness to make glossy paints matt-er.

[smokingwreckage]

ced, that's an excellent reference!

[Wren]

and didn't find the kneadatite. Is that kind of stuff not online or not in the store at all. I literally am starting with nothing but two of the reaper starter sets from the kickstarter.

I haven't ever seen kneadite in a Michael's, Joann's, AC Moore or Hobby Lobby. You might find it locally in a place that sells GW or Reaper supplies, such as Hobbytown. It is something I would consider ordering online from somewhere I know gets fresh supplies, as it does get old and not work as well or the same once it's old. (At the very least, if you find a package in your local game store covered in dust, don't buy that one. :->) Once you do get some, you can store it in your freezer to prolong its freshness.

There are other two-part epoxies. Milliput is pretty easy to find in places like Hobbytown, which may also have a brand called Apoxie Sculpt. (Note that I'm specifically referring to Apoxie Sculpt, there are other Apoxie type products, but the others I've tried, I didn't like very well for our purposes.) Both of those two products differ slightly from Green Stuff. They are both a little water soluble. This allows you to use a small drop of water to smooth the product up against the existing surface, so it's easier to get smooth joins. They cure hard, so you can sand them or carve them after they cure, which gives you additional options for what you can make, and how. However, that hard dry might not be the optimum product to use to do conversions with Bones, which are a flexible plastic.

Both of those putties also are only a little bit sticky. So they're not great for using to do pinning, but will work well to fill gaps you might have after you pin something with glue. They're a little cheaper than Green Stuff, so if you plan on doing base stuff like making rocks or earth, they're more cost efficient and much easier to work with for that purpose. Green Stuff is super sticky, though the consistency changes slightly as the mixture starts to cure. Some types of manipulations are easier or harder at different stages of the curing process. People have compared it to working with chewing gum, and that's not a bad comparison. It's not at all crumbly and holds fine details incredibly well, but it is tricky and annoying to work with for many people.

Green Stuff is an excellent product. I do use it, but I tend to try to use it only when I have to. If you aren't sculpting figures that have to survive the rigours of the casting process, it's fine to use whatever works for you. I was unaware that there were alternative putties with different properties when I first started out, and very happy to learn it!

[ced1106]

Speaking of Michaels, I was looking on their online site to see what to buy there. I didn't see any flow aid. I found matte though. The brushes on the website were all synthetic Martha Stewart, and didn't find the kneadatite. Is that kind of stuff not online or not in the store at all. I literally am starting with nothing but two of the reaper starter sets from the kickstarter.

It looks like you're a fellow n00b (: and I wouldn't worry about kneadite or sculpting for now *unless* you're actually interested in sculpting, want to make some 3D shields for the clockwork dragon, or really need to have your multi-part molded figures to fit together (like these cheap Battle Masters wolves...). But speaking of sculpting, if you plan to play miniature games with your mini's, you might want to look into building terrain. Those 200+ mini's in March will need to fight *somewhere*!

[smokingwreckage]

Train modelling supplies are good for trees, I bought about a hundred some years back.

[cthulhudarren]

Now I'm trying to find that post where someone had found that using airbrush additive(?) for their brush-on paint helped with base coating bones since you can't use any water for the base coat (water makes the paint bead up on bones). I figured that I would "prime" my bones by basic blocking of the colors on the mini. But aren't the colors straight from the bottle too thick and wouldn't flow into all the right places? That's why someone had said they discovered using airbrush additive to get the flow improvement, etc. If only I could remember/find what that product was.

All I know is I want to block in the colors as a base coat, need to thin and improve the flow of the paint, but not use any water.

[Last Knight]

Now I'm trying to find that post where someone had found that using airbrush additive(?) for their brush-on paint helped with base coating bones since you can't use any water for the base coat (water makes the paint bead up on bones). I figured that I would "prime" my bones by basic blocking of the colors on the mini. But aren't the colors straight from the bottle too thick and wouldn't flow into all the right places? That's why someone had said they discovered using airbrush additive to get the flow improvement, etc. If only I could remember/find what that product was.

All I know is I want to block in the colors as a base coat, need to thin and improve the flow of the paint, but not use any water.

It was in the thread on solving the issue with metallic paints.

ETA: this one - http://www.reapermin...__fromsearch__1