14 replies to this topic

[DavidVC04]

So I have finished hundreds of models by brushing on Gloss Varnish (Vallejo), then Matte Varnish (Vallejo or Reaper), then Dull Cote. Last night I opened a new bottle of Vallejo matte varnish after the gloss was done. It was thick, but the stuff is usually thick. I applied it lighter. This morning.

My horses aren't ruined, but the paint job is degraded. It's kind of like they're behind a dirty window. I paint to compete for best painted armies at Warhammer GT's, so I'm a bit despondent that these won't meet muster. And the skin on these was quite nice, a chestnut with several layers. And what's goin...what's going on ...I can't see what I'm typing...this is annoying.

Anyhow...I thought about trying some thin washes of Kel's brown to try and restore some of the tone, but I have a feeling I'm just screwed. I paint slowly, and working full time and being in school doesn't leave me time to say, oh well, and do them again.

Is there any hope, or am I as screwed as I think I am?

[Rastl]

Ah, varnish that frosted. I "lost" 4 dwarf grunts to that last month.

I stripped and repainted. I tried to salvage them since I saw it right away but with no luck.

I don't know if anyone else has salvaged minis where the varnish has frosted but hopefully someone has better news than me.

[morganm]

What are the causes of a forsted varnish like this?

[DavidVC04]

What are the causes of a forsted varnish like this?

In my case, the varnish went on too thick. It should be more or less invisible when dry. For me, frosting means a spray coat of varnish that went on too thick. Imagine something that looks like a waxy film on the model. It's quite discouraging. :(

[Rastl]

I use the term "frosted" as a generic for "my varnish is borked".

Mine happened with brush on varnish as well. It was supposed to be matte and it ended up putting a film over the minis.

[Maltique]

I also don't recommend some of the brush on sealers. They never seem to come out even for me. I prefer a spray-on gloss-cote (or 2) and then a dullcote on top.

[DavidVC04]

Well, the Dull Cote helped quite a bit and most of the brush strokes left by the varnish process are gone. I've lost a little detail, but it's much better. I'm going to glue on the riders, do a light Dull Cote again, and cut my losses.

From now on, I'm sticking to Reaper brush-on sealer and then dull cote.

[psyberwolfe1]

Liquitex Matte Varnish (satin finish really) will knock this problem down most ricky-tick. I've actually fixed miniatures that were totally ruined by frosted varnish with the stuff.

[Bush Craft]

You just paint the Liquitex Matte Varnish over top of the frosting and it goes bye-bye??? Please tell me it's that simple. Please.

[Vaitalla]

Applying a new coat of varnish over the top will often "re-activate" the frosted layer and remove a great deal, though not all, of the "frosting". We used to use Testor's Dullcote for this; not surprised to learn that other varnishes will work as well. Glad you were able to salvage most of the work, David!

With spray-on sealers, I have seen "frosting" happen on humid days, and on cold days. It tends to be a side-effect of moisture bonding with the sealer on spraying, or a temperature anomaly.

"Frosting" with brush-ons can be caused by too much flatting agent in the layer. This is often caused by not enough shaking during the course of use; when you get to the end of a bottle there is more matting agent proportionally than there should be. It can also be caused by an "uneven" batch from the manufacturer, where the matting agent has started to settle out at the time of pumping and then some bottles end up with more than they should have. At Reaper we had an issue with this problem once; after that I lessened the amount of flatting agent and we stir all batches while they are being pumped to make sure that the matting agent stays in solution.

I'm sure there are probably other reasons for the "frosting" phenomenon, but those are the ones I have personally experienced.

--Anne

[cerebro1974]

I have had the same trouble, now I find it hard to use anything but Testors Dullcote

[Vaitalla]

Dullcote was the first sealer I had frost on me, so be aware, it is not Immune to the issue! These days I typically use MSP brush-on, if I seal at all, but I suspect no sealer is completely safe from this.

--Anne

[Harlequinn]

I guess I've been lucky and not had a problem with frosting as of yet.
While Testor's Dullcoat is the painter's standard for sealing minis, I would highly recommend Testor's Model Master Lusterless Flat Lacquer Overcoat (No.1960). I've found this stuff to be hands down the best miniatures sealer around. Three coats of the stuff and your miniature is done and protected for normal use. Never had frosting issues, never needed a gloss or polyurathane coat (though if you are rather rough on your minis a poly-coat may not be a bad option), no yellowing, and metallic paints aren't dulled down very much. The downside is that it is in a small can and expensive. However if you want a good flat protected coat on your minis, I have yet to find anything better.

[Madog Barfog]

I guess I've been lucky and not had a problem with frosting as of yet.
While Testor's Dullcoat is the painter's standard for sealing minis, I would highly recommend Testor's Model Master Lusterless Flat Lacquer Overcoat (No.1960). I've found this stuff to be hands down the best miniatures sealer around. Three coats of the stuff and your miniature is done and protected for normal use. Never had frosting issues, never needed a gloss or polyurathane coat (though if you are rather rough on your minis a poly-coat may not be a bad option), no yellowing, and metallic paints aren't dulled down very much. The downside is that it is in a small can and expensive. However if you want a good flat protected coat on your minis, I have yet to find anything better.

Is that archival, meaning will it hold up over time? I liek Golden MSA Archival spray. It's meant to preserve artwork, whereas the standard Testor's product is for the hobby market.

[gr8fulphish]

Dullcote was the first sealer I had frost on me, so be aware, it is not Immune to the issue! These days I typically use MSP brush-on, if I seal at all, but I suspect no sealer is completely safe from this.

--Anne

Anne. How often do you seal your mini-masterpieces (i.e. showpieces, competition, etc.)?