17 replies to this topic

[morganm]

I'm getting confused with all of the chemicals. Wondering when which chemicals should be used for what circumstances. I had bought some flow improver to help thin my paints. Then I bought acrylic thinner and matte medium to bring some old GW paint pots back to life. Now I have some brush cleaner to strip minis. I have on order the MSP Additives 1 triad (sealer, flow improver, and primer). I now have more chemicals than paint =P This weekend I found myself adding Matte Medium to paint mixes... why? Because I had confused matte medium with matte varnish! I'm getting lost here! Please pick any of the items below and reply with information such as what it is, what it's intended to do, how to properly use it, when to use it, and some other things you can do with it. Please be specific; if you are talking about a medium or varnish please refer to it as Matte Medium or Semigloss Varnish. Also feel free to talk about a product you don't see listed below.

Acrylic Thinner
Flow Improver
Medium (matte, gloss, semigloss)
Varnish (matte, gloss, semigloss)
Sealer
"Dullcote"
Extender
Brush Cleaner & Restorer

[Kang]

Great questions! I know they're great, because I don't know all the answers! :o)

But I have a few... maybe. I'll do my best to indicate which answers I'm not 100% sure about, and count on others to correct any errors and fill in the blanks.

Many of the chemicals you've listed are used as additives to the acrylic paints most of us use to paint minis.

I have been under the impression that acrylic thinner and flow improver are the same thing; flow improver is, I believe, Windsor & Newton's brand name for acrylic thinner. I could very well be misinformed about both these aspects of this, but no doubt someone will correct me if that is the case. It works by reducing surface tension, causing your paint to run more readily into nooks and crannies, hopefully without leaving behind an unsightly ring of colour when it dries from a pool, as in a wash. It can also be used in addition to water to thin your paints so that they go on smoother, albeit requiring more coats to get full coverage. Reaper Master Series paints have some already mixed in, as may some other brands. Not sure about the other brands though.

Dullcote is a very popular matte varnish made by Testors. Some say it dries "dead flat" but I have yet to achieve that, personally. Probably bad spraying technique on my part. Often used over a layer of gloss varnish to kill the shine (the gloss varnish is better for protecting your paint jobs, hence its use prior to Dullcote). The drawback is that it may yellow slightly over time - other brands exist that do not have this problem, yet Dullcote remains pretty much the de-facto standard from what I can tell. I've read it is sometimes used to "save your work" - spray it when one part or layer is done 'properly' so that if you have to wash off something that gets painted later, you won't lose this too.

I believe extender is another word for retarder, just less rude sounding. If true, it makes your paint take longer to dry. Use for wet blending or painting in very arid climates. Not sure about other uses for this stuff.

The mediums are a total mystery to me - seems like every time I hear about them being used, it's for some different purpose, possibly including making paint more transparent, which is apparently very different than thinning them, though how that is so remains a mystery to me. The names make it sound like they're just to make your paint more or less glossy than it started out, but I don't think I've heard of them being used for that very often, oddly enough.

I believe a sealer is just that - it seals your mini for protection from the elements, which can include such horrors as greazy gamer fingers, neon orange Chee-to "seasoning" powder, and Mountain Dew spills. Dullcote and the varnishes you've listed would be sealers, though there might possibly be such a thing as a sealer that is not a varnish???

Brush Cleaner & Restorer is another W&N product, IIRC. The name says it all - use it to maintain your brushes. Apparently it makes a wonderful stripper if you need to remove paint quickly and effectively (on those lonely nights when your wife is out of town - not so much). Actually, from what I have read recently I have to wonder why anyone ever uses anything else to strip, if this really gets ALL the nooks & crannies others miss AND works faster than just about anything else AND is not too harsh a chemical...

Matt means not shiny at all, though in certain artist's circles it means not *too* shiny and 'flat' means not shiny at all.
Gloss means very shiny, ie. wet-looking.
Semi-gloss is somewhere between matte and gloss in shininess.

I'll definitely be checking this thread to see what I got wrong and what others have added! A long overdue thread, IMO - thanks for posting it.

Kang

[Sergeant_Crunch]

And to further confuse things, sometimes you'll run across a Satin sealer. That means shinier than you want as it's just another way of saying "semi-gloss."

[All-Terrain Monkey]

Covered in another thread, but I thought I'd touch up on it here; Winsor and Newton Brush Cleaner and Restorer works absolutely fantastically... on metal minis. It can react with some plastics and doesn't always get the same quality of result as it does on metal, so use something else from the huge list of stuff in the stickied post in this forum for plastics.

I'm just curious as why you _need_ a ton of chemicals for painting. What are you trying to do that you're unable to that convinces you more additives are needed? I get by with Dull Cote or RMS Brush On Sealer for sealing, Brush on Sealer to help with glazes, and Winsor and Newton Brush Cleaner to give my brushes a good cleaning every six months or so.

[Hot Lead]

Many of the chemicals you've listed are used as additives to the acrylic paints most of us use to paint minis.

Primarily yes. Because of the naming conventions different companies use things get confusing. One company might call the product a "thinner", another an "extender", or a "blending medium". (Sort of like the paint naming conventions gaming companies use. Outside of the fine art community, there is no consistency in color names.)

I have been under the impression that acrylic thinner and flow improver are the same thing; flow improver is, I believe, Windsor & Newton's brand name for acrylic thinner. I could very well be misinformed about both these aspects of this, but no doubt someone will correct me if that is the case. It works by reducing surface tension, causing your paint to run more readily into nooks and crannies, hopefully without leaving behind an unsightly ring of colour when it dries from a pool, as in a wash. It can also be used in addition to water to thin your paints so that they go on smoother, albeit requiring more coats to get full coverage. Reaper Master Series paints have some already mixed in, as may some other brands. Not sure about the other brands though.

Depends on the company. Generally a "flow improver" is just as you described.

I believe extender is another word for retarder, just less rude sounding. If true, it makes your paint take longer to dry. Use for wet blending or painting in very arid climates. Not sure about other uses for this stuff.

The mediums are a total mystery to me - seems like every time I hear about them being used, it's for some different purpose, possibly including making paint more transparent, which is apparently very different than thinning them, though how that is so remains a mystery to me. The names make it sound like they're just to make your paint more or less glossy than it started out, but I don't think I've heard of them being used for that very often, oddly enough.

I believe a sealer is just that - it seals your mini for protection from the elements, which can include such horrors as greazy gamer fingers, neon orange Chee-to "seasoning" powder, and Mountain Dew spills. Dullcote and the varnishes you've listed would be sealers, though there might possibly be such a thing as a sealer that is not a varnish???

There's basically 3 major areas of acrylic products:

Additives - actual chemicals which alter the behavior of the acrylics.

• Improve surface adhesion - Do you want your acrylics to glide smoothly and stick cleanly? Then use a flow enhancer/improver/release. All these terms mean a water-thin medium which breaks down surface tension. This prevents the acrylic (essentially plastic) from dragging on the surface, causing streaks or blotchiness...
  
  Generally does not affect matte or gloss of paint, unless too much is added.
  

  Examples:
  Liquitex Flow-Aid
  W&N Acrylic Flow Improver
  Golden Acrylic Flow Release
  Reaper Flow Improver
  Decoart Floating Medium
  

• Slow drying time - Do you want your paints to take longer to dry? ("Sure, we all do!") Adding these mediums means the "open" time of the acrylics is greater, giving you between a few minutes to 10-15 extra minutes to blend them, depending on the amount of medium added and thickness of the paint.
  
  These range from thick, goopy versions suitable for tube paints to water-thin versions better for our paints. Also sometimes called "blending medium" or "retarder".
  
  Generally does not affect matte or gloss of paint, unless too much is added.
  

  Examples:
  Liquitex Slow-Dri (thin)
  Liquitex Slow-Dri (thick)
  Golden Retarder
  W&N Acrylic Retarder
  Decoart Brush n' Blend
  Delta Ceramcoat Gel Blending medium
  

Mediums - Acrylic binder of similar consistency and behavior to actual paints.

• Increase paint "volume" without adhesion loss - Do you want to spend less money on paint? (aka make your paint go further.) By adding these mediums you can use less paint to cover roughly the same area. Some transparency results, depending on how much medium you add, but because of the binder the paint usually retains the same working qualities as straight out of the tube or bottle. Usually this is for fine artists trying to stretch their tube paints.
  
  Does affect sheen of paint: you determine whether the dried paint is matte, satin or glossy, depending on the medium you use.
  

  Examples:
  Liquitex Matte Medium
  Liquitex Gloss Medium
  

• Increase thickness/texture - Basically all the gel, structural, tar, sand, etc. mediums fall in this category too. They all let you stretch your paint out, though these mediums use heavier thickeners and/or texture agents to create interesting effects.
  
  Does affect sheen of paint: you determine whether the dried paint is matte, satin or glossy, depending on the medium you use. Primarily, canvas painters use thwse to create oil paint-like effects for acrylics or wacky, structural painting works.
  

  Examples:
  W&N Gel medium
  Decoart Thickening medium
  

Varnishes - Protect a finished piece.

• Seal your paint - Are you done and ready to protect your hard work? Basically a permanent, hard acrylic coating to seal and protect a finished piece. May or may not contain UV protectants, acrylic resins, polyurethanes, etc. depending on formulation. Usually intended to be permanent and not reworkable, though depending on the type (matte vs. glossy) it can be used like a clear primer. (I.e. Dullcoate has a "tooth" so you can paint over it, because paint sticks to it.)
  
  Does affect sheen of paint: you determine whether the varnish used is matte, satin or glossy. End result can be to kill sheen or add shine.
  

  Examples:
  Testor's Dullcoate
  Reaper Brush-on Sealer
  Krylon Crystal Clear
  Krylon Matte Varnish
  GW 'ard coat
  Decoart varnish
  

Where the problem lies is naming conventions, like I said, and blurring the lines... Paint companies often try to mix different effects into their mediums, or at the very least advertise those effects... For example, yes, adding Matte Medium to a paint makes paint dry longer, because it's just thicker stuff and takes longer to dry. So the company says it slows drying time. Well yes, it does, but not the same reason as a pure "extender" does. The extender slows the chemical reaction that changes acrylic from a liquid state to solid plastic as it dries, whereas the medium just adds more stuff to the paint, so it takes longer for the stuff to dry.

Don't even get me started on the GAC polymer mediums: http://www.goldenpai...ymers/index.php

"Confused? Tune in next week for another episode of 'Soap'...."

[morganm]

Thanks for the replies; this is great stuff and really helps.

AT Monk: I bought them on recommendations based on questions. For example I was having problems with GW paint pots drying out so it was recommended that I use thinner and matte medium for acrylic paints to add in to the paint pots to bring them back to life (which worked great). Another example was all the reading I did about how to thin paints and almost all of them suggested flow improver products. Before you know it I have 5 bottles of chemicals in my paint set and still need to buy more =P (I need some brush on sealer and probably some dullcoate)

I don't mind having and using them but I was starting to get confused as to which does what. This will be a helpful reference for myself and I hope for others.

[Mclimbin]

I had the same questions as you a few years ago and asked around, did some research, and came to some understanding about additives. I learned a lot from Laszlo (Hot Lead, above) too, because as you can tell, he has a lot of experience in using fine art paints.

Anyway, here is another way to answer your questions, or rather, another way to organize the information:

What do you want to do with your paint?

• I want to thin my paint
  Most of the high-end painters that I have talked to thin their paint with water. I have never heard one of them talk about using acrylic thinner. In fact, a lot of high end painters don't use any chemicals at all, and just use water for all their different applications. Others use lots of chemicals. Your call.
  
• I want to keep my paint from drying too quickly
  See Hot Lead's explanation of extender/retarder here. This is especially good if you are doing wet-blending. If you are doing layering, then you want your paints to dry quickly on your model, so stay away from extender, and get yourself a hair dryer.
  
• I want to make a wash
  A wash is used to shade the nooks and crannies of a mini. Some painters just use water, some use flow-aid. I like a little flow aid in my washes. I also use flow aid for lining. I am able to control the thinness of the line more easily with a little flow-aid in there. Some painters also use flow aid for free hand designs, for the same reason.
  
• I want to make a glaze
  A glaze is a super thinned, translucent mix. It can vary from having a lot of pigment to having almost none, so that it's almost clear. Again, some painters use just water. Some painters use a medium, as some paints separate when they are thinned too much. Some painters use brush on sealer (especially Reaper, though I've heard of other painters using 'ard cote by GW for this). These are good for glazes, in my opinion, because they add to a thinned paint's viscosity without adding more pigment. It's easier to control where your paint is going if it is a little more viscous. I've been using Reaper brush on sealer lately instead of medium and I have to say I like it better.
  
• I want to protect my paintjob from damage
  See "sealers" above.

So, you can see that using chemicals is really your call. Some great painters (like Laszlo, Anne, Jen Haley) use a variety of chemicals, and some great painters (Jeremie Bonamont Teboul, EricJ of Wyrd) just use water.

Personally, I was hoping that by using chemicals like Laszlo, Anne and Jen, my painting would become world class just like that *snaps fingers.* I was sadly mistaken.

[Jabberwocky]

Great information! Is it possible to sticky this? I recall there have been a number of threads in various forms asking similar questions and I always end up thinking "I remember a thread on this somewhere..."

[morganm]

Another fine resource pointed out in another thread by psyberwolfe1 which explains a lot about Reaper specific products but still great information!

Casket Works 22 on page 85 (warning: 20.40mb PDF)
http://www.reapermin...m/misc/CW22.pdf

[Vaitalla]

Personally, I was hoping that by using chemicals like Laszlo, Anne and Jen, my painting would become world class just like that *snaps fingers.* I was sadly mistaken.

As Jennifer and I have told people down through the years "there are no secrets to good mini-painting". There are plenty of cheats and shortcuts, but when it all comes down to executing the paint job you want to see, it's practice, practice, practice. Jen and I (and Laz!) practiced and made plenty of mistakes over months and years of endeavor before we achieved a point where we were noteworthy, and much of what we did was in a relative vacuum. You guys have the advantage of SO MUCH information (though of course you are cursed by TOO MUCH information... ) and so many of us who have been doing this for ages are ready and willing to answer questions and teach...don't lose heart! But before you start loading on the additives, listen to the Monkey, above. Learning how your paints react with just a little water and flow improver before you start experimenting will stand you in good stead. Then once you are familiar with paint consistencies needed for all the basic techniques and different paint lines you may use...branch out!

--Anne

[Vaitalla]

Great information! Is it possible to sticky this? I recall there have been a number of threads in various forms asking similar questions and I always end up thinking "I remember a thread on this somewhere..."

Unfortunately we are fast getting to the point where the entire first page of this forum will be stickies. With threads like this where it is one major post we'd like to keep track of, may I instead suggest doing a simple Copy and Paste to a text document of Laszlo's post? He pretty much says it all and then you have a copy to keep, perhaps organized into a folder in your email (which is what I do) or on your desktop, where you can find it easily in the future.

--Anne

[Helltown]

The first thing I did when I heard about all these additives was rush out to buy them all... Now after having them for a little more than a year these are the few that I tell my fellow novices that they should look into:

1. A jug of distilled water (Maine tap water tastes icky, so why paint with it...), kept tightly capped.
2. A bottle of RMS Brush-On Sealer (helps washes and glazes, and prevents Cheez-it crumbs from wrecking a perfectly passable paintjob).
3. A rattle can of Dull-Cote (for when the patience isn't there for a brush-on sealer)
4. A rattle can of Krylon gloss sealer (because just about everyone I've talked plays with their minis)

Happiness is another 8 slots in my paint carrying case for actual paint.

If you don't want to spring for additives to help your washes, Citadel's Foundation Wash Set... lotsa colors, premixed, and ready to brush on, spray at, or dunk into.

[psyberwolfe1]

Great information! Is it possible to sticky this? I recall there have been a number of threads in various forms asking similar questions and I always end up thinking "I remember a thread on this somewhere..."

Unfortunately we are fast getting to the point where the entire first page of this forum will be stickies. With threads like this where it is one major post we'd like to keep track of, may I instead suggest doing a simple Copy and Paste to a text document of Laszlo's post? He pretty much says it all and then you have a copy to keep, perhaps organized into a folder in your email (which is what I do) or on your desktop, where you can find it easily in the future.

--Anne

Good advice! Speaking of links, here is the link to Liquitex where one can find all sorts of gems on this subject. They are a great resource for artists of all levels and hobbies.

[Hot Lead]

Personally, I was hoping that by using chemicals like Laszlo, Anne and Jen, my painting would become world class just like that *snaps fingers.* I was sadly mistaken.

As Jennifer and I have told people down through the years "there are no secrets to good mini-painting". There are plenty of cheats and shortcuts, but when it all comes down to executing the paint job you want to see, it's practice, practice, practice. Jen and I (and Laz!) practiced and made plenty of mistakes over months and years of endeavor before we achieved a point where we were noteworthy, and much of what we did was in a relative vacuum. You guys have the advantage of SO MUCH information (though of course you are cursed by TOO MUCH information... ) and so many of us who have been doing this for ages are ready and willing to answer questions and teach...don't lose heart! But before you start loading on the additives, listen to the Monkey, above. Learning how your paints react with just a little water and flow improver before you start experimenting will stand you in good stead. Then once you are familiar with paint consistencies needed for all the basic techniques and different paint lines you may use...branch out!

--Anne

I'd also add (and hope this doesn't drive Michael bonkers ) that as you learn you'll change your methods anyway... I don't paint like I did 10 years ago and I'll likely continue to change my methods over time. Anything else leads to artistic stagnation. For instance, after I discovered slow-dri, I used it for everything for a while there, but eventually I found disadvantages to that. Every additive and method has its relative strengths and weaknesses. The key is learning to use them all and picking most appropriately for the task at hand.

Take care,
Laszlo

[Vaitalla]

Word! But seriously, absolutely! Jen and I don't paint the same now as we did a decade ago, either. You learn from others, you incorporate some of what they do and toss out the rest...until you go back and give the rest a try years later! You experiment, you hate it, then months after that you get a sudden inspiration of how you could make it work...and suddenly it's a major part of your painting repertoire. An artist who doesn't evolve is doomed to be left behind the curve, and loses the excitement that drives anyone's best work.

--Anne